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Hardware

HP DVD100i DVD+RW Burner Tested 209

Posted by timothy from the hardware-lust-spirals-upward dept.
An anonymous reader writes: "I'm fairly sure this is the first review of a DVD+RW drive. Looks like it fared well in testing. The only downsides to the 100i are slow DAE with audio CD's, lousy manuals, and it can't read DVD-RW (note the dash instead of the plus) discs. Still a tad expensive at 599USD though. Are you reading, Santa?" I want this as a heavy-duty *external* drive :)
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HP DVD100i DVD+RW Burner Tested More

HP DVD100i DVD+RW Burner Tested

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  • Santa is listening... (Score:5, Funny)

    by Xenopax ( 238094 ) <xenopax.cesmail@net> on Monday December 10, 2001 @01:54PM (#2682832) Journal
    An anonymous reader writes: "... Are you reading, Santa?"

    Yes, but who do I deliver to?

    -Santa

  • Comparison to Apple SuperDrive? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Outlyer ( 1767 ) on Monday December 10, 2001 @01:55PM (#2682839) Homepage
    Just for a point of comparison... how does this differ from the Apple SuperDrive DVD writer (you've seen the ads) which is included in high end Powermacs? According to Apple's website [apple.com] the SuperDrive is a DVD-R drive, which I was told, couldn't write DVD-Video... so how are they accomplishing it?

    • Re:Comparison to Apple SuperDrive? (Score:4, Informative)

      by yipyow ( 317154 ) on Monday December 10, 2001 @01:58PM (#2682860) Homepage
      there are many different formats of dvd recordable/rewritable formats: dvd-rw, dvd-r, dvd+rw, dvd-ram...

      http://www.brouhaha.com/~eric/video/dvd/

      chris

    • Re:Comparison to Apple SuperDrive? (Score:5, Interesting)

      by martin-k ( 99343 ) on Monday December 10, 2001 @02:00PM (#2682877) Homepage
      Well, there is:

      * DVD-R & DVD-RW (Pioneer/Apple)

      * DVD+RW (HP, Ricoh et al.)

      * DVD-RAM (Panasonic)

      Ignoring DVD-RAM (it needs cartridges and is not really DVD at all), and DVD-R (there are no DVD-Rs available AFAIK, but all DVD-R recorders can also burn DVD-RWs), it boils down to deciding whether to go with DVD-RW or DVD+RW.

      If I had to decide NOW, I'd choose DVD+RW for the simple fact that it can burn at 2x while DVD-RW will always be written at 1x.

      Better of course to wait for a couple of months for prices to come down and speed to go up ...

      -Martin


      • and DVD-R (there are no DVD-Rs available AFAIK, but all DVD-R recorders can also burn DVD-RWs),

        This isn't true. We have a Pioneer S201 which burns only DVD-R, not DVD-RW. Perhaps you mean the other way around?
        • See? I got all those acronyms mixed up, too ...

          What I meant to say is that there are no DVD+Rs available (although specced), not DVD-Rs.

          In any case, with the prices of DVD(+/-)RW media going down, there is not much of a point in buying DVD-R media (which are available) or DVD+R media (which are not yet available).

          -Martin
          • I don't know if its true that there's no point to DVD-R. I've yet to purchase a CD-RW disc for instance. I don't see the point. CD-R media is dirt cheap and there's multisession recording. For small archives of stuff I can just rewrite it as a new session. For larger volumes of stuff I can just toss the CD-R and burn a new one.


            DVD-R and DVD-RW will be much the same way for a long time. A DVD-R is about 4 bucks, a DVD-RW is about 9 bucks. As DVD-RW drops so will DVD-R, if it has multisession (not at all sure it does) then I'd be inclined to stick with DVD-R.

      • Ignoring DVD-RAM (it needs cartridges and is not really DVD at all)

        I'm not sure what you mean by not really DVD, but type II DVD-RAM discs can be removed and played in DVD drives.

        They only need the cartridge to write, I used to have an external Panasonic drive, and it played CDs and DVDs fine (including movie DVDs, not just data discs) without cartridges.
        • type II DVD-RAM discs can be removed and played in DVD drives.

          Sure about that? I read some article that said that DVD-RAM drives can read DVDs, but DVD drives cannot read DVD-RAM.

          Panasonic seems to be planning DVD drives that can also read DVD-RAM, but generic, run-of-the-mill DVD drives probably cannot. (It's hard to imagine how they could, with the completely different layout of the sectors).

          -Martin

          • *Some* DVD-ROM drives will read Type II cartridge-less DVD-RAM drives, many of the newer ones in fact.

            *Some* DVD players will even read them, but its fairly rare since there is little incentive to add it as a feature unless you're using a common DVD mechanism that just happens to support DVD-RAM.

        • Many DVD-RAM drives don't even need the cartridge to write a Type-II disc, I know my Hitachi will write Type-II with or without the cartridge.

          Since only one DVD-ROM i have will read DVD-RAM Type II's, and its the DVD-ROM in the same machine, it makes no sense to remove the disks from the cartridge though for me, as the cartridge adds a little extra dust/scratch protection.

      • What do you mean by, "there are no DVD-Rs available"? Surely you don't mean drives that are only DVD-R since you state that they, "can also burn DVD-RWs". Do you mean
        DVD-R Media [apple.com]? Because that is clearly available.
      • Although I have never shopped here, TigerDirect [tigerdirect.com] has some good prices on DVD-RAM's as well as DVD-R & DVD+RW, well below the $25.00 / disc prices of last year.
      • Mod this parent down!

        This is complely incorrect. I have a Pioneer DVR-103 which is also known as the DVR-A03 and it burns both DVD-R and DVD-RW media at 2x. This is the same drive that shipped with the Compaqs and Apples. Currently, I am using Nero Burning Rom, but it will burn at 2x in Sonic DVDit, and other DVD applications. Full DVD's only take 26 minutes.

        For more information (correct information that is) check out these sites.

        www.cdfreaks.com (CD Freaks)
        http://perso.club-internet.fr/farzeno/firmware/ (Firmware upgrades -- pretty important)
        http://www.cdrinfo.com/ (CDR Info)
        http://www.dvdwriters.co.uk/ (DVD Writers)

        -eric
    • The SuperDrive is Pioneer's DVD-RW/CD-RW drive. It does it all, including burning of DVD video (up to 2 hours with iDVD 2, Apple's free software for assembling video with a DVD interface that works on any DVD player or DVD-equipped computer).

      There's still lots of infighting for standards, and the SuperDrive is list priced at $899, so I wonder which is the better bargain. "Combo" drives (plays DVDs, read/writes CDs) are used a lot with Apple hardware, and should be easily available for PCs, so I wonder what makes this drive so special.

  • $600? we'll all own one in three years (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Frothy Walrus ( 534163 ) on Monday December 10, 2001 @01:56PM (#2682847)
    this is great. $600 now means they'll be $150 three years down the line, and they'll be as ubiquitous as CD-RWs are now.

    boy there's gonna be some piracy problems :D
    • So will this drive be able to get past the Super Audio CD protection that Sony is imposing on consumers? What about that law that says pretty much that you're allowed to make a back up of everything you own? Hmmm, I don't like the looks of this. I mean sure, piracy = bad. I guess you could say that I'm not the most careful person with my coasters, err, cds, so if one bites the bullet, that's what the backup is for. Maybe DVD+RW will come to the rescue :o)
    • it's not like these things haven't been around for a while. check pricewatch [pricewatch.com]. i got someone a refurb toshiba dvd-ram in february 2001 for $200.

      chris
    • Yup. Plus obnoxious anti-piracy measures on commercial DVDs.

      When DeCSS first appeared, I remember pundits saying, "Oh well, no biggie, nobody has that much disk space to spare." Repeat after me: Moore's Law. Moore's Law. Moore's Law.

      • Not.

        Moore's so-called Law had nothing to with anything beyond the density of transistors. Stop citing it for everything from hard disk size to the number of pr0n pictures on the net!
        • I knew I'd get this "correction".

          First, metaphor and usage have extended the application of of the term "Moore's Law." If it were a real scientific law, that would be uncool (thought still inevitable). But it's not. It's just a observation about manufacturing costs.

          Second, the number of transistors you can pack onto a chip has everything to do with the cost and power of electronic products. Prove me wrong: build a DVD player using vacuum tubes!

  • Uhm, why? I always wondered what it was about people and external drives. Do you plan on swapping this across multiple systems? Or do you just want to be "cool" for having an external DVD+RW? From what I've seen, most external CD-like solutions are enormous, unless you get a PCMCIA slimline version, but I don't see any slimline DVD burners coming out any time soon, heh.
    • So that when it freezes up you have some hope of resetting it without having to reboot the file server to which it is attached. You always need the greatest archive capacity on your most critical system!

      sPh
      • "You always need the greatest archive capacity on your most critical system!"

        Okay, so use a tape drive. They're a bit more proven in the industry IMO, and you can pick up a 20/40 drive for about half the price of the DVD+RW.
        • Please, try running something from a tape drive... it ain't happenin.

          I remember a while ago there was some "special" tape drive that would allow immediate access to a certain 125mb or so on the tape, but I have no idea who made it.
          • Who said anything about running it directly off the media? I'm sure that would be ideal, but for the most part this threads implication was "backup-only device".

            Either way, I still think NAS or even a fire-wire hard drive would be more efficient.
        • Um. Unless you're running a *serious* corporation's IT section, the degree to which DVD-RW\? is *already* proven is more than sufficient.

          For a small business, you have the following options:

          (1) Tape drive storage. More space than you probably need in the immediate future, high-ish price, proprietary format (usually) and the usual incompatibilities between various OSes. Large, but not infinitely so, MTBF. Unusual drivers. Exotic hardware. High TCO.

          For instance, at work we used to have a setup with a DP-30 Onstream parallel port 'Windows Tape Drive'. Terrible story: When the drive died, we lost access to 2 years of backups. Furthermore, even before its demise, it never really worked right. The W2k drivers were almost completely broken, and in fact the blasted thing would refuse to install itself on W2k-server, apparently because the included software (incl. driver!) was intended for 'personal backup' (read: had crippled fileperm/ownership handling) and therefore wished us to buy a 'real' archiving package in order to store the measly ~4gb of critical data. Evil! Bad!
          Since the dratted thing also wouldn't talk dirty to WinME, we eventually ended up re-installing 98SE on a machine in the corner, which would drag 4gb of server-side data across the network every friday night. I was almost in tears from the aesthetic trauma alone, not to mention frustration.

          (2) DVD storage. Improved versatility, cheap-ish media (esp. if you're re-writing). Reliable media with a very nice lifespan. :) shorter MTBF, but high probability that the next one you're going to purchase will be $200 at Wal-Mart rather than $900 from a reseller specializing in obsolete media formats. Additionally, your media that can read from almost any modern computer, which can SAVE YOUR BACON during a serious crisis.

          Yes, I hear you say, but what about that time when you *really* *really* need capacity? Well, with compression -- which is what all the tape drive figures are assuming, BTW -- you get ~9G of storage; having to swap CD's a couple of times for a large backup isn't that onerous.

          Only when you're at the 5-6 swap-per-backup point -- that is, ~50gb+ -- do you really need to consider a more industrial solution. And at that point, you're interested in a $1700 tape drive, not a $400 model.

          But what about Moore's law? Surely in a couple of years, your capacity needs will (at least) double?

          Well, aside from being an incorrect application of Moore's law, this 'law' simply fails in the face of fact. We've been in business ten years, and in that time our data requirements have gone up from virtually nil to 4gb. Another 4gb in ten years is credible, so that's the figure we run with. (We're not a dot-bomb; no explosive growth, no explosive fall, just steady improvement in sales.)

          Also, don't forget that a DVD backup solution (once the drives are cheaper) will allow 'localized' or 'workgroup' backups, wherein five or six computers handle their own data storage and backup. Rather than driving the whole wad of data over the LAN, we can just use cron to burn to disc in each workgroup, and collect those.

          AAR, the small company I work for has had no problem with our DVD-backup solution. I should know; I'm the one who advocated and installed it. :)

    • Re:Heavy Duty External? (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Jeffrey Baker ( 6191 ) on Monday December 10, 2001 @02:03PM (#2682898)
      There are plenty of advantages to an external. First: an external must by SCSI, 1394, or USB, so it won't use up one of your limited motherboard IDE ports. Second: you can swap an external between many systems -- beats having to transfer gigabytes of data over a network. Third: you can turn an external off when you aren't using it. My external CD-RW has probably been on for less than 2 days in the three years I've owned it. This will extend its life. It also saves energy. Fourth: with all external drives, you can have a pizza-box computer. If you want hard disks, cd, cd-rw, dvd, and dvd-+rw in the same case, it has to be an enormous tower.
      • My internal CD-ROM drive turns itself off when not in use.
      • Your second point goes against the reason why you would have a network in place. It might make it easier if you had to transfer between two systems that are not on a network.
        • Ahh, but he said transferring gigabytes of data over the network... On a 10megabit connection this can literally take hours, sometimes even overnight. It would be very convinient to be able to do something like swapping an external drive.
      • Which is why I asked if he was going to swap across multiple systems.. But you may want to snip USB out of there; burning 5 gigs of data over a 1.2Mbps pipe is most likely not the most efficient way of doing it, hehe.

        SCSI/IEEE1394 would be a ton better, but I just don't see an instance where you'd need a 5 gig storage device to be "portable". Unless you have a LOT of systems that you need to copy huge amounts of data/raw graphics/movies/etc off of... And in that case I'd still think some form of network attached storage would be optimal.

        As for using this for a dedicated backup system, it doesn't seem like it would really fit the build ;/
    • Just slap the drive into an external SCSI case and off you go. Some of my friends use external SCSI cases with a CD-ROM drive as a CD player.
    • Maybe for those of us who work predominantly on laptop computers perhaps.
      • I work mostly on my Toshiba S353-3000 actually, but I'm almost always around a network of some sort. Unless you've got 1+gig cad files or something on your *laptop* of all places (if that's the case, I'm very sorry, and will gladly admit my fault) I really don't see why one would come in too handy. I have about 5 DIVX's on here, that's the only thing I could think of using one for... But I'd have trouble justifying spending $600 on something to make a backup of 5 movies.
    • There's good reasons for this. Say my family gets a video camera compatible with computers & burning DVDs of home-movies. If family goes on vacation down my way, they can burn a DVD for me before leaving. If I go to them, I can burn a DVD to bring home with me, and not have to tote my entire system around, just the drive. And make a few copies at once to save mailing disks around, just hand them out when everyone is in the same place...

      Or I could lend it to a friend who can't afford the drive but does have a suitable camera. Or to use it to make hard drive backups of various machines around the house (currently 3 systems of my own and 3 systems belonging to roommates) Lend it to friends for backups, etc. Not to mention the potential backup use for computer repairs places to restore data in case "something bad/worse" happens, backup usage for bigger companies that only want to buy one drive, etc.
    • While others have replied with other good reasons, there is one important reason that everyone has missed.... PSU dependance...

      With an internal DVD-R drive you're talking about quite a lot of extra power drain on your PC's PSU. Not a big deal if you're using a P2, but on a P3/P4/Athlon with a power hungry video card, it can make enough of a difference to need a new PSU. I know PSU's aren't that expensive, but the hassle of disassembling a working system to replace the PSU IS. And yes, its a lot more hassle than adding an IDE drive would be.

      An external drive means an external/seperate PSU. When you have 3 or 4 external drives, the advantage is probably close to 200W of power dependance removed from the PC's PSU.

      Also, as I understand it, DVD-R's can run quite hot, another good reason to remove them from the 'main' PC case if possible.

  • PC Magazine Review (Score:5, Informative)

    by wiredog ( 43288 ) on Monday December 10, 2001 @01:58PM (#2682857) Journal
    Right here [pcmag.com]. They compare it with the Sony dvd+rw.

    Note that dvd+rw and dvd-rw drive can both write dvd-r disks that can be played in a standard dvd player. So it's not quite vhs vs. betamax.

    • That is not correct (Score:4, Informative)

      by cqnn ( 137172 ) on Monday December 10, 2001 @02:39PM (#2683107)
      AFAIK DVD+RW drives cannot write to DVD-R media.

      There will be a supplemental media released
      "early" next year... DVD+R which will fill the
      cheap recordable gap in the media line for
      DVD+RW drives.

      For the time being the only media you will be able to
      get for the HP, Phillips, and so forth drives will be DVD+RW.
      Which is one of the reasons I am holding off (saving up) for
      a drive in a few months.
      1. It will be clearer which standard is more compatible.
      2. The media selection for both should be better at that point.
    • Checkout the DVD+RW Alliance's page [dvdplusrw.org] for more info.

    • My few cents (Score:2, Interesting)

      by quark137 ( 248723 )
      I have the Pioneer DVR A03. It records DVD-R, and DVD-RW both. I also have a 3 year old Pioneer consumer DVD player. I assumed that DVD-R's will play on the DVD player, but what surprised me is that I was even able to play DVD-RW media on my DVD player!

      A little off-topic: From experience, Dazzle DVC II is a great card for capturing TV/VHS video. I also have the higher end Dazzle "Dv Now.AV," and it's simply superb. To top it off, it comes with the full version of Adobe Premiere 6.0!

    • Re:PC Magazine Review (Score:3, Interesting)

      by elinenbe ( 25195 )
      Ug! Why don't people do research before they blindly post. The DVD-R drives burn DVD-R disks that can play in a MUCH greater number of players then a DVD-RW disk.

      Here are some compatibility charts:
      DVD-R compatibility in DVD standalone players (apple.com)
      http://www.apple.com/dvd/compatibility/

      DVD-RW compatibility in DVD standalone players (ricoh.com)
      http://www.ricoh.co.jp/dvd/cope/video.html

      Personal test of DVD-R, DVD-RW, and DVD+RW compatibility (labdv.com)
      http://www.labdv.com/en/hardware/dvd_player.php

      -eric

      -eric

  • Apple got there first (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Andy_R ( 114137 ) on Monday December 10, 2001 @01:59PM (#2682867) Homepage Journal
    Maybe the poster of this article should look for reviews of Apple's G4 desktop macine, it's been shipping with a Panasonic DVR-103 DVD-RW drive as standard for quite a while now.
  • /.
    While DVD+RW may eventually become the industry standard, you're still gambling until a true standard unequivocally (sp?) emerges.
    Look at what 56Kb modem prices did once the v.90 standard was published.

    SO, I'm still waiting!
    --Charlie
    • Look at what the prices did once the standard was published, eh? Nothing! They didn't go anywhere! The reason modemn are so cheap is because they are winmodems! The good modems, such as the USRs, haven't ever changed in price, from the $99.99 I paid about 4 years ago, to the $99.99 they are charging now. Or $119.99 for their "gaming" modem. No, there's a bit more volume on modems, but the prices didn't change a bit, not because of the standard.
      • Pyromage wrote:
        Look at what the prices did once the standard was published, eh? Nothing!

        That's simply not true. I priced the USR 56 Kbps "sportster" modem less than two months before the V9.0 standard was published and then again six months or so later - the price drop was, as I recall, quite noticeable - especially compared to the way the 56-flex and 56x2 had been holding their prices for the previous year.
        The sportster is not a *great* modem, but it's a good modem, to use your terminology - I have close to a hundred of them on site here and they have always worked just fine. And of course the price of crappy winmodems is down to about $10 now. I got one for free ($10 - $10 rebate) at Best Buy, but I haven't found any use for it as yet.
        Sorry I haven't any non-anecdotal evidence to post...
        --Charlie
    • It's not so bad. Since DVD+RW drives can read DVD-R and DVD-RW discs (as well as vice versa), it doesn't matter much which you go for. They can't write to each other's media, but reading is fine.

      The main things to consider are the drive itself (speed etc), price (drive & media), and perhaps availability. DVD+RW is supposedly a little more compatible that DVD-RW, but the difference isn't apparently that large in users' experiences.

      That said, I'm personally holding off until DVD+RW drives can also write to DVD+R media. That'll be cheaper than rewritable media, and more compatible (rewritable discs - of either standard - have different reflective properties, which confuses some older players into thinking it's a double-layer disc).

      HP don't have a clear position on whether current dvd100i drives will be firmware-upgradeable to support DVD+R (Ricoh make the drive unit itself for HP, and they won't say either). When I know that the drive I buy will do this too, I'll be first in line :-)

  • I went to Bestbuy last night and saw a generic CD-RW drive for $79 before rebate. If you shop around, you can get CDR's or CDRW's for about $.50 apeice, usually with a rebate that makes them more or less free.

    You can also get a DVD-Rom drive for about $100.

    All this considered, it would literally be cheaper to buy both drives than the all-in-one combo. Even if it did manage to burn DVD-RW, it would still be cheaper in terms of media cost to have both drives and burn data onto CDR or CDRW... that is... unless you actually *need* an entire DVD-RW's worth of storage capacity in contiguous media.
    • CD-RW drives cannot burn DVD-RW or DVD+RW.

      DVD+RW drives cannot burn DVD-RW, and visa-versa (until someone makes a drive that does both).

      DVD-R media can be had for as little as $5USD apiece. Given that is 4.7GB, that is the equivalent of about 7 CDR's. Not too bad, in terms of price/MB.

      Ever try to back up a 40GB drive to CDR? That's about 60 disks - a real pain. Eight or nine DVD-R's would be much easier and quicker.
      • Granted I don't know exactly what a DVD-R records per second, but would a 2.4x DVD-R burner really be much faster than a 24x CD-R burner? I can understand dealing with 8 or 9 disks being easier than dealing with 60, but I think it would probably actually take longer to do.
    • Don't know about DVDs, but for a CD-RWs, you don't necessarily want the cheapest drive you can find. In the long run, you can save yourself quite a bit of grief and money if you do some research before you buy.

      Stephan

  • I hope I'm incorrectly calculating that a full 4.7GB write would take 3.6 hours.

    • Re:2.4x = ? (Score:2, Informative)

      by Oily Tuna ( 542581 )
      You are incorrect. It will take about 24 minutes.

      2.4x = approx 3Mb/s
    • I hope I'm incorrectly calculating that a full 4.7GB write would take 3.6 hours.


      I'm not sure, but I think they may be using a different x. When you say your CD-ROM drive is 24x, the x means 115 kB/s or something to that effect. When you talk about a 2x DVD drive, the x has a different (bigger) meaning. I think. Anybody know details?

  • Can you write data onto a DVD+RW disc and then read it with a DVD reader?

  • VHS to DVD (Score:4, Informative)

    by wiredog ( 43288 ) on Monday December 10, 2001 @02:09PM (#2682929) Journal
    Now you can move your vhs tapes to dvd for less than $1,000. The Dazzle Hollywood DV-Bridge [dazzle.com] is $300 (it comes with a ieee 1394 card (Lucent chipset)) and converts analog inputs (from the composite video jack on the tape deck) to digital video, which goes over the 1394 link. The VCR looks like a digital camcorder to the card. Be advised that DV takes up about 15Gb/hr.

    I have one of those (DVD recorder is on the list to get) and it works fairly well. Get the Pinnacle DVD authoring software ($40 at Best Buy) because the bundled software isn't any good.

    • Oh do you mean like this [networksstatus.com] software that I keep getting e-mail about.

      And don't forget that if you buy it today you'll get the Playstation wizard today. I hate spam...

    • ... which will not only record DV (via 1394) and analog video (via S-Video or composite), but also includes a TV tuner, EPG, PVR functions, S-video/composite out, RF remote control, Ulead Video Studio (not too bad) and a pretty darn good 3D card too :-) Price: $399, available RSN.

      Or you can just go for a $50-100 analog capture card (with no DV support).

  • DVD+RW (Score:2, Interesting)

    by House of Usher ( 447177 )
    Hmmm, so all the hype here really is over a drive that is rewriteable and has the capability to hold how much data? 18 GB total maybe? Plus they're sort of slow. Then again, the first CDR drives were painstakingly slow as well.

    My feelings are two folded. I guess I am happy that the DVD+RW is finally around, mostly because I don't want to see DVDs go to the wayside like many economists were saying that they would (then again, what do they know really?). But at the same time, with companies like Constellation 3D out there with their Flourescent technologies out there, I'm wondering why this sort of media storage hasn't been developed more. Constellation 3-d [c-3d.net] uses a flourescent technology to store up to 140 GB of data on a single disc. This would be more than enough to be like that of HDTV :o) Alas, such things are not in the forefront of the news as I guess most companies are scared to invest in something so powerful.

    Oh well, like others I'd love for Santa to bring me an external unit... :-)
    • Alas, such things are not in the forefront of the news as I guess most companies are scared to invest in something so powerful.

      I would think that the prospect of storing 140GB on a single disc could threaten to drive technology company CEOs mad with the lust for power, perhaps even awakening a long-imprisoned ancient evil that threatens to consume us all.

      Also, I've been playing the new Wolfenstein too much.
    • It's spelled "fluorescent", it will hold "20 - 100 Gigabytes of pre-recorded data" and you can't put one in your DVD player.

      Still, 100 GB per disc ain't bad at all. They do have a WORM version, no rewritable yet it seems. However, I'm still waiting (and waiting) for them to produce a real product...

  • Cost (Score:3, Informative)

    by hether ( 101201 ) on Monday December 10, 2001 @02:10PM (#2682943)
    At $15.99 a disk, the cost they mention in this CNet article http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1006-200-6909288.html [cnet.com] from August 19, I don't think its all that affordable. With the drive costing $600, the total costs would just be too high. Sure you can record repeatedly for each $16, but you're going to want to have more than one thing on disk at any one time, requiring additional disks. I realize that's cheaper than competing DVD rewritables so far, but still too much.

    • Re:Cost (Score:1, Interesting)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Well, if you're comparing the cost to CD-R's right now, then yes. But as an affordable option for archiving data, these things beat the pants off of the alternatives. We generate large amounts of test data from multi-channel high frequency sampling. The current method of archiving is to use magneto-optical disks, also from HP. The drives will set you back $3k a pop, and each 5.2 gig disk will run you another $75. Those $600 DVD+RW drives and $15 media look pretty cheap in comparison eh?

  • DVD Demystified (Score:4, Informative)

    by Agave ( 2539 ) on Monday December 10, 2001 @02:11PM (#2682944) Homepage
    The best site I've found that goes through all the differences between DVD formats is in the DVD FAQ [dvddemystified.com] at DVD Demystified [dvddemystified.com]

  • Waiting for standards unification (Score:3, Insightful)

    by jpostel ( 114922 ) on Monday December 10, 2001 @02:11PM (#2682948) Homepage Journal
    I waited on the 56k v.90 standard for a while and I can wait on this to get sorted out too. If it were something a little bit cheaper then I would not mind spending the money on this, but since they cost >$500 I will wait.
  • Can this drive make perfect copies of DVD movie disks? For backup purposes, of course.
    • I dont know but with the price of blank DVD media right now it would probably be cheaper to just go buy the dvd at the store than to bother burning your own copy.
      • depends on hte movie.
        if the drive is a 4.5 gig version...then all it can fit is 4.5 gig of vob files(roughly an hour and a half video). or u can always downsample and recreate the dvd(SVCD comes to mind)
        A 4.5 gig svcd can reach some pretty high bitrates(probably up to the max of 2.5 Mb a sec, which would look pretty damn nice, along with high quality sound(unfortinatly cant be higher than 44.1KHz, svcd standard)

        so, if the movie is short(Pi comes to mind), then it can be done
        but if ur thinking of doing a bit to bit with pearl harbor.....think again
    • As a DVD can hold 14GB, and DVD rewriteable are no where near that capacity... the short version is "no". Add to that CSS(content scrambles system) encryption.... and well no you can't just make a bit for bit copy.. AFAIK. Anyone care to correct me?

  • it's a good piece of pie (Score:2, Informative)

    by myrth ( 51912 )
    hi,

    i've had one of these for the last month and have found it to be an incredibly reliable and useful tool.

    i haven't run across a bad cd/dvd write yet with it, and while the software is very vanilla, it is still quite useful.

    installation was very simple, and with media prices dropping, i'm happily looking forward to finally feeling secure about having enough back-ups...

    -myrth

  • Info (Score:1)

    by hether ( 101201 )
    http://www.thetechnozone.com/pcbuyersguide/hardwar e/storage/HP-dvd100i.html
  • If you want the HP DVD+RW drive as an external, get a Firewire external chassis like the ones from http://www.apdrives.com . I have not specifically tested the HP drive in one of these, but everything else I've tried works great.
  • It looks like Pioneer's drive is now cheaper than the new HP one, and I think the disks are cheaper, too. Plus, it is readily available, and so are the DVD-R's and DVD-RW's. It also works with Linux, at least to write CD's. I've done it.
  • I'm still waiting for two things:
    • Until the empty media becomes cheaper,
    • The drives become cheaper...

    Otherwise, this _would_ make a nice backup medium though. For personal use it seems to expensive for me still, although CD-R/CD-RW's give me headaches sometimes (they're well... too small and stuff). Actually, I use 'em almost as floppies somewhat.

    Also, the thing is that there is also an RIAA tax (am I right here?) that makes all of this even more expensive... I don't see myself switching over to DVD-R or DVD-RW just yet, nor do I see others do it, for the concerns expressed above.

  • how about 40 GB per disk for $100? (Score:4, Funny)

    by turbine216 ( 458014 ) <turbine216@NosPAm.gmail.com> on Monday December 10, 2001 @02:33PM (#2683067)
    ...It's called a hard drive. They're REALLY cheap these days, and they have INCREDIBLY FAST seek times. Oh, and they can be written to and read from without any additional software. Oh, and they're compatible with ANY operating system.

    Seriously, though...these things are still WAY too expensive to justify buying one, unless you're one of those guys making a six-figure salary who buys everything, no matter the cost. Then again, i guess they have to go through this phase before they're going to bring the price down anyway, so whatever. But for now, I'll take a bunch of hard drives over a DVD-RW or DVD+RW any day.

    • Re:how about 40 GB per disk for $100? (Score:1, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward
      ...It's called I only have 4 IDE ports and wasting them on small hard drives is not what im gonna do... And besides everytime I want to take some data to a friends house im not gonna want to open up my pc to take out my harddrive and then bring it with me - a small dvd would be a hellova lot easier...
    • They're worth it for the guy who wants to start making high quality media he can watch on his DVD player, though.

      I'm more interested in the DVD-video aspect and transferring my DVDs onto backup DVDs instead of DIVXd CDs. I also have a digital camera that is begging to be paired with tech like this.

      As soon as the prices reach the point where I can spend less than 400 USD on a burner and less than 5 dollars per disc, then I will definitely pick one up. Until then, though...

  • Linux test so far ... (Score:2, Informative)

    by dltaylor ( 7510 )
    I put one in one of my Linux boxes last week. So far, I have read CD-Audio (grip) and CD-ROM (iso9660), DVD-ROM (iso9660), and a Video DVD ("Chicken Run") with no problems. I have written to CD-RW media, both CD-Audio and CD-ROM, with cdrecord.

    As soon as I get some time, I will test DVD-Video and DVD-ROM formats on DVD+RW media. Any idea where I should post the results?

  • Other reviews (prior art :-) (Score:3, Interesting)

    by eddy ( 18759 ) on Monday December 10, 2001 @03:05PM (#2683253) Homepage Journal

    cdrinfo [cdrinfo.com] reviewed the Ricoh 5120A [cdrinfo.com] (CDRW and DVR+RW) months ago. Then they did the Philips DVD+RW 208 [cdrinfo.com].

    The current review is of a 32x writer, the Mitsumi CR-480ATE [cdrinfo.com], so no need for a "Woow! First review of a 32x writer" in two months :-)

  • I've been waiting for affordable DVD recordables for a long time. In a previous life, I spent a lot of time taping Phish and other bands that allow taping. I have over 500 DATS that I want to transfer to another format. DAT tapes start to degrade around five years after they are recorded on. CDR works but it takes 3 CD's for one concert. What I would prefer to do is use a lossless compression format such as SHN [softsound.com] and put 10+ DATS on one DVD-R.

    The technology is there but the media prices are ridiculous. DVD-R prices hover at around 15 to 25 bucks. The drives are not too bad, the HP drive goes for around $560 street but until the media comes down to earth it doesn't seem worth it for me. Now if I had an interest in video, I would pick it up in a heartbeat.

  • I personally want to see CDs and DVDs eventually (meaning I know they won't die off tomorrow) be faded out in favor of say 1394b buses + compact flash, smartmedia cards, SSDs, or <insert_your_fave_really_fast_non_volatile_mem_ type_here> :)

    I mean think of the access times, Megs/sec, the size of the media, reliability, possible applications... It just seems the intelligent choice to make (and if not flash memory, maybe IBM's magnetic RAM or some similar non-volatile mem)!

  • Importsnt questions not answered. (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Lumpy ( 12016 ) on Monday December 10, 2001 @03:55PM (#2683516) Homepage
    What is best for writing dvd video discs?
    the only reason I want a DVD-R or RW or +rw or a r*(rw/r)^rw or whatever they want to call it this week is to make my own DVD flicks (Ok and maybe backup my PS2 DVD's..) but mainly for taking my DV cam's video and spitting it to a nice disc for friends, relatives, archival... basically to completely remove any need for VHS.

    What drives will write a disc that is readable in any DVD player I wander up to?

    what drives are supported under linux?

  • Comment removed (Score:3, Informative)

    by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Monday December 10, 2001 @05:17PM (#2683946)
    Comment removed based on user account deletion
  • Alright, so I'm lazy. Can someone please answer me this: is it possible yet for me to take my DivX ;-) movies, turn them into VOB files, burn them, and play them in my DVD player? Last I checked the answer was an uncertain "no." Or, more accurately, I tried to figure this question once before and was unpleasantly surprised to discover the myriad of formats out there: DVD-R, DVD-RW, DVD-RAM, DVD+RW, blah blah. Every player seems to be incompatible with about half of them, but it's never the same half. So I assumed no. Has anything changed?

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