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Handhelds Hardware

Farewell to PDAs, Hello to Smart Phones 162

Posted by CmdrTaco from the well-they-are-gonna-converge-anyway dept.
Roland Piquepaille writes "Is it time to get rid of your PDA? Apparently yes, according to General Motors, writes Ephraim Schwartz in InfoWorld.The subtitle of this story is pretty clear: "GPS, Java, and push-to-talk give smart phones a clear edge over PDAs." "General Motors announced last week that it will partner with wireless carrier Nextel to use Nextel?s Motorola cell phones with data capabilities to market a field-force management application to its commercial truck fleet customers." GM chose these cell phones because people feel more comfortable with, but also because they can run sophisticated applications. And of course, because they are cheaper than handhelds, both to purchase and to maintain. Check this column for a summary and references."
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Farewell to PDAs, Hello to Smart Phones More

Farewell to PDAs, Hello to Smart Phones

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  • Darth Vader's PDA (Score:5, Funny)

    by the darn ( 624240 ) on Sunday May 25, 2003 @09:40AM (#6034658) Homepage
    "a field-force management application" But what I really want is a force-field management application...

  • Not quite right... (Score:4, Insightful)

    by splerdu ( 187709 ) on Sunday May 25, 2003 @09:42AM (#6034661)
    Look at the phones now... it's not that phones are getting the advantage over PDAs, it's that the distinction between a phone and a PDA is slowly disappearing.

    I've had the chance to play with some of the new offerings from Sony-Ericsson, Nokia and Samsung and honestly they are barely different from a small Palm.
    • Disappearing? I disagree. Yes, a lot of phones have PDA options, and there are PDA's that work as phones, but until the right interface comes out that pleases everyone comes out and it becomes pseudo-standard, I think we'll see a lot of people using two devices.

      Why two devices? Phones and PDA's have different technical requirements taht don't easily combine. A cell phone uses a minimal screen, needs about 12 buttons, uses audio and has a short battery ilfe. 2-5 hours talk time.

      PDA's need large screen
      • Why two devices? Phones and PDA's have different technical requirements taht don't easily combine. A cell phone uses a minimal screen, needs about 12 buttons, uses audio and has a short battery ilfe. 2-5 hours talk time.

        You should take another look at the phone store, the new SonyEricsson p800 has a screen almost the size of the phone itself and instead of buttons has a touch-sensative screen a la Palm. Yet it acts and feels just like the cell phones that you use right now.

        If it had G3 support and didn'

    • I think it's obvious that the merger of the cellphone and PDA has been going on for some time.

      After all, the Handspring Treo incorporates the function of the Handspring Visor PDA into a GSM-compatible cellphone; Samsung last year released a cellphone with similar features.

      I expect within 2-3 years many high-end cellphones will be like the T-Mobile Sidekick, with full PDA functions complete with small keyboard on one unit with a separate headset; it will sport Bluetooth functions that allow the unit to ope
    • as soon as the current phone companies can make a working phone network then the expense of combining all your PDA information into the phone would be viable. Today, you can't count on having a connection and your carrier can change services on you and often do. Forcing the change of providers and many times, a change of the phone too. Do you want to spend $600 on a phone every year or so and figure out how to get your data from the previous $600 phone into the next model?

      I'll keep my PDA/handheld and mobi
    • I used to have a Palm and then upgraded to an e740 which I had paired with a SE T68i. This let me browse the net, have PIM functionality, check my email, see if anybody was about on my IMs etc etc. The problem was having to carry around two things, travel with two chargers - I started leaving the PDA behind when I was out and about.
      I've now replaced both with a P800. It's a little bit bigger than my old phone, but still easily fits in my pocket and more importantly does absolutely everything I want. Whilst
  • But the user is still stupid.

  • Is it really time? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by SN74S181 ( 581549 ) on Sunday May 25, 2003 @09:42AM (#6034667)
    Is it time to get rid of your PDA? Apparently yes, according to General Motors

    Definitely no, according to anybody who wants to partition their personal data into a private space unconnected to snoops, spies, and busybodies.

    I prefer to be the only bridge between some information and the outside world. So I say 'no thank you' to the notion that everything on my PDA should be connected in real time to a telephone/digital network every time I make a phone call.

    Nope. Not interested.
    • So, I assume therefore that you have a laptop, shielded from radiation of course, without wireless, and a separate battery charger for it, so that there's no way data can get off of it without you doing it right? I bet CD manuf's love you for the amount of discs you burn to get stuff between the two systems.

      Paranoia like this is stupid. Yes, you make a phone call. This doesn't mean that your entire address book gets sent at the same time, nor does it mean that your folder full of hot hot 120x90 pr0n get
      • It's not paranoia. It's just putting some things only where they're accessable by keypad and LCD.

        And ask Outlook Express users about their entire address book getting sent all at the same time...
      • Paranoia like this is stupid. Yes, you make a phone call. This doesn't mean that your entire address book gets sent at the same time, nor does it mean that your folder full of hot hot 120x90 pr0n gets sent to people either.

        A certian level of paranoia is stupid. Other levels of paranoia are not.

        His level of paranoia seems reasonable to me.

        He's not trying to protect against, say, a government attack using unlimited resources. He's simply insuring that the only possible way information crosses fro
    • At least in the US cell carriers love being in total control of "their" hardware. So even if you have a very powerful hardware platform capable of doing MP3/GPS/browsing, the networks might limit what you can do with it within some artifical pricing model that extracts money from you for any useful bit of computing you perform with it. I'm thinking of some of the current Java phones that have no local means of synchronization and require you to go through the carrier for uploading any apps into the phone--f

  • Not for me... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by BrokenHalo ( 565198 ) on Sunday May 25, 2003 @09:43AM (#6034668)
    Frankly, I don't really see the point. I use a phone to make phone calls. (Duh!) OK, I do use SMS a bit, too.

    But let's face it, prodding at that kind of keypad with an index finger is not a convenient user interface. I use WAP quite rarely since it it's usually much more convenient to wait a little while until I have a moment to sit down at a proper computer.

    • Frankly, I don't really see the point. I use a phone to make phone calls. (Duh!) OK, I do use SMS a bit, too.

      But let's face it, prodding at that kind of keypad with an index finger is not a convenient user interface.

      Frankly, I don't really see the point. I walk when I want to make journeys. I can carry things in my hands. Lets face it, pushing on the handles of that 'cart' thing with the 'wheels' on is not a convenient user interface... and who needs this newfangled fire stuff to keep warm? It's usu

  • as long as
    I plan on
    seeing my
    ====>next

    information
    in chunks
    greater than
    ====>next

    16kb at a
    time!
  • Is it time to get rid of your PDA? Apparently yes, according to General Motors

    but I just got it [tigerdirect.com] on Tuesday!! Do I really need to ditch it already? It's soooo sweet!!! =D
  • GM chose these cell phones because people feel more comfortable with, but also because they can run sophisticated applications.

    IMHO the people that are not comfortable with PDA's don't use the calendar and such features on a cell phone. What the cell-phone plan does is let people carry around less bulk. (IMHO people will leave there palms in the car and take there cell phones to the office and not the other way around)
  • and all PDA's evolve until they can make phonecalls.
    • No text editor is complete untill it's a web browser. Conversly, no web browser is complete untill it can edit text. In this case we see that no PDA is complete untill it's a cell phone and no cell phone is complete untill it's a PDA. Free softare projects are more complete than their propriatory counterparts which bloat disproportionatly.

  • Health concerns (Score:1, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward
    I know they haven't officially linked mobile phones to cancer (but hey what doesn't cause cancer these days?) - however personally I am not that keen on having a PDA that irradiates me every time I use it.

  • My problem with current cell phone/PDA combos (Score:5, Insightful)

    by JaredOfEuropa ( 526365 ) on Sunday May 25, 2003 @09:52AM (#6034691) Journal
    There are already a few phones out there that combine a regular cell phone and the functionality of a PDA. While I like the idea of carrying one device instead of two, I hate every signle one of these phone PDA's that I have tried. Why? Mainly because the PDA functions aren't very good. I guess that phone companies are lousy at making PDA's, and they seem to focus on phone-related functionality.

    Here's what I would do if I were them: start with a really good PDA, much like the current line of PDA's from the well-known brands. That means you have Java, you could add GPS and whatever, you already have an address and phone book, and a means to enter phone numbers and SMS messages easily. To add phone functionality, all you need is a GSM/GPRS module, and perhaps a mike and loudspeaker.

    Another thing: PDA's are fully programmable. Here's a tip for mobile data providers, we don't need proprietary mobile data applications, we just need data transport. Once we have that and our programmable PDA's, we can build our own apps. We don't have or want to rely on silly protocols such as SMS or MMS either: just let us send regular emails, perhaps with an attachment.

    In other words, try making a cell phone out of an organiser, not the other way around.
    • Yeah, I never understood the point for SMS. My phone does straight email (with attachments). (and also has GPS w/ maps, etc.) Cost me only ~$40USD too. Of course, it was a discontinued model.. newer versions take movies and stuff, and they were getting rid of the one I got to get those out the door.

      Too often though people buy in to the plans that don't have the email. They only have the direct-to-phone-number type (which aren't compatible between carriers here). Quite annoying.
    • > In other words, try making a cell phone out of an organiser, not the other way around.

      Well actually Kyocera has done a decent job of this. I just recieved my 7135 smartphone, and oh baby is it sweet. Only a little bigger than a Motorola StarTac too. 65k color screen, Palm OS 4.1. What's interesting is the phone itself is a palm application - if a call comes in while you're firing off an e-mail or playing Lemmings, it'll pause that app so you can take the call. Even upload MP3s as ringers ;)

      Suppo
      • I agree.
        I've had my Kyocera 6035 for over a year now, use it every day, and love it. The only things that I would change are 1)add a Color screen , and 2) get a somewhat smaller form factor. It's about the same size as a regular palm pilot, which makes it huge in terms of current gen cell phones.
        When it gives up the ghost, I will move straight to the 7100, or to an equivalent *nix based one.
    • In other words, try making a cell phone out of an organiser, not the other way around.

      Isn't that what the Handspring Treo [handspring.com] is? I'm not sure what can be done about the SMS problem, except that most carriers are building out their web services and may offer "normal" email one day. Old Palm software suffers from it's legacy roots as a plug it into the PC to work thingy. It would "sync" with an email client instead of having it's own mail agent. PDA's like the Zaurus are finally breaking away from that mod

      • ... which T-Mobile has already dropped?

        http://www.wirelessnewsfactor.com/perl/story/21 5 35 .html

        Also, you can't find their PocketPC Phone Edition available for sale on their website anymore.

        I personally use a Handspring Visor Pro w/ a VisorPhone attachment. True, it's a bit bulky, but that's never really bothered me. Plus, it's a full-sized PDA, and if something should happen to my Visor Pro... I have a 2 MB Visor I can plug the VisorPhone into in case of emergency. :)

        Just my $.02...
  • Obviously whoever made this decision for GM never actually wrote an app on the Nextel platform! Compared to a PDA, they're borderline useless.
  • That was when I got myself a Nokia 7160. It doesn't have all the features of the Palm but it's a heck of a lot more convenient. I also like the small form factor. I've been holding out on ugrading it because I don't really care for the wide "PDA with built in cell phone" format. I much prefer the phone with built in PIM functgions. Today most of these are lagging in performance.

  • Form Factors (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Zarquil ( 187770 ) on Sunday May 25, 2003 @09:57AM (#6034703)
    I used to think I wanted a cell phone and PDA all-in-one device. I've waffled again and flipped back.

    I genuinely like my m125. But hold it up to my ear and talk? Nope, it's not a comfortable size and shape. My phone has a scheduler and various unused contact management features, mostly because it's a pain to input.

    I drool at the gadget stores each time I see a new version, but so far I've been disappointed in what I've gotten my hands on.

    My current thought: Bluetooth running from a PDA to a bug in my ear would be really cool. But cool does not make practical, and I expect to be disappointed with that, as well.

    I think I'll stick with single-purpose tools that do their one job well, and hope that everyone gets their poop in a pile and offers good interoperability. It's a time honored tradition!

  • Does anyone know if this is the Linux powered [bargainpda.com] motorola phone?

  • May not always want a phone (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Gemini ( 32631 ) on Sunday May 25, 2003 @09:57AM (#6034707)
    "Sir, please put away your phone while you are on this flight!"

    "But, it's my organizer..."

    "Sorry, it's a phone. Put it away."

    • Re:May not always want a phone (Score:1, Interesting)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Most of the smartphones have the ability to turn the radio functions off. However, you still have to convince both the passengers and airline staff of this. A printed statement from the airline is about the only realistic way to go, but far from certain. Another is to let them play some of the games...if there is a hint of a geek in them you might have some chance.

      Even if you did manage to persuade the stewards, every passenger would say something when passing you on the way to the bathroom.

      • My phone has this feature, but I always turn my phone off on flights. I know I am able to turn off the radio, but there are too many idiots out there who'll insist that "the radio's turned off!!" when it's really not (just think of all the people who claim their phone is in silent mode until it starts beeping Britanny Spears). If they'll take my word for it, they'll have to take everyone's.

        Atleast until my plan of labeling all fools is successful.

    • They already sorted this one on the SPV and P800 you can turn off the phone segment of the device, convincing a luddite stewardess on the other hand might be a little harder

    • "Sorry, it's a phone. Put it away."
      Airlines don't make you put your cellphone away; they make you turn it off.
    • I just saw the first half of this scenario play out on a flight from Boston. The lady with the phone/pda just turned the screen toward the flight attendant and said, I'm just entering information. Flight attendant was satisfied, no problems.

      I guess you could run into a cast-iron idiot up there, but by and large if you can make a case that you're in compliance they don't want to hassle you, and don't really have a lot of time to either.
  • "field-force management application"

    Is this something that will let them fire/layoff people remotely? That's what "force management" tends to mean to me. ;)

    • Re:Huh? (Score:2)

      by fgb ( 62123 )
      of course I read that as force-field management and thought "Cool! a PDA that projects a personal force-field around me! Watch out evil-doers!"
    • Is this something that will let them fire/layoff people remotely? That's what "force management" tends to mean to me. ;)

      Oh yeah, paperless pink slip. It's so much cheaper to give someone a pink slip, but hey this is the 00's. Gotta keep up with the newest way of shit-canning.

      -employee recieves gadget labled "force management" and nervously turns it on.

      Gadget: You are fired. Plese press the X to callibrate the screen, then follow the directions.

      Cool, the supervisor does not even have to waste his l

  • Comment removed based on user account deletion
    • Ah, this is so true. I personally let the phone ring so someone else can answer it (if they're home). I have a tendancy to sleep in late sometimes (a curse of setting my own work hours - because I never have a stable sleep pattern). When the phone breaks into my sleep it is really irritating. Now the sound of a telephone ringing annoys me considerably. I just really don't like them.

      Mobile phone is the same, except now people can annoy me while I'm out as well as home.

  • Differing design requirements... (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Moderation abuser ( 184013 ) on Sunday May 25, 2003 @10:04AM (#6034727)
    Phones have to last for several days or even a week always on and without recharge, have to be easy to carry and easy to make and receive calls.

    PDAs have to be easy to use, powerful, flexible, colour, large screens. When you add these features to phones, you lose the easy to carry and battery lifetime features of phones.

    All of the smartphones i've seen have made poor PDAs and poor phones.

    • I love my Handspring [handspring.com] Visor, it's monochrome, and it goes two weeks without a recharge.

      Something most pda's are getting away from now is that pda!=multimedia. I want to use my pda as an organizer. I couldn't care less about video or taking shitty 640x480 pictures with it which seem to be the l33t features all these new cell phones have. Playing mp3s might be cool though....

      My cell phone's a Nokia 3360, it's tiny, gets good reception, and is braindead easy to use (just like my Visor). I don't really want
    • Just because the current ones are poor PDA's and poor phones does not mean that we (they) won't eventually get it right. But the question is irrelevant - is it a PDA with a phone built in, or a phone with a PDA built in?

      If they merge, then neither is rendering the other obsolete. It just means that either one on it's own is no longer as important - once the cost is not important.
    • I think the "marriage" of PDA and cellphone actually makes plenty of sense. I've been using a Kyocera "Smartphone" QCP-6035 for over a year now, and while it's far from the ideal solution - I think it was the closest thing available at the time I purchased it.

      The QCP-6035 actually has excellent battery life. (Perhaps some of that stems from the fact the phone itself is on the large side, allowing a fairly good sized battery to fit in it. But in any case, it has standby and talk times greater than many r
    • I'd rather have a PDA that lasted weeks without a recharge than a powerful one with a colour screen (and two hours of battery life), but that seems to be almost impossible these days.
  • Some people will want a single unit that is a combination of a cell phone and a PDA, and that's fine with me. I'm sure those kinds of combo units will become increasingly available.

    However, I don't want a combination unit. Why? My cell phone is small, stylish, and convenient. Adding a reasonably sized PDA screen to it would make it bulky and inconvenient, at least for me.

    I know a lot of people who feel the same way. Therefore, I think that stand alone cell phones, stand alone PDA's, and combination u

  • Reasons why NOT to combine the two (Score:5, Insightful)

    by xigxag ( 167441 ) on Sunday May 25, 2003 @10:06AM (#6034735)
    1) Combo will either be too big for an ideal phone or too small for an ideal pda.

    2) PDAs should have long battery life. But they don't when part of a power-guzzling cellphone.

    3) Can't talk and tap at the same time. Unless you've brought along the earpiece attachment. But then there you go carrying two objects again.

    4) PDA/cellphones usually seem to be less expandable or a few OS versions behind the latest solo PDAs.

    5) In the US, switching to a different wireless carrier means switching to a different phone. With a combo unit, you'd have to switch to a different PDA too.
    • 6) some of us have a PDA but have no need whatsoever for a cell phone. I have a clie that I use for the usual PDA stuff, but I mostly use it as a voice recorder to take notes.

    • Combo will either be too big for an ideal phone or too small for an ideal pda

      The Kyocera 7135 [kyocerasmartphone.com] is only a couple of millimeters bigger than a Motorola Startac, a very popular phone. As for being too small for a PDA, the 2" screen of the 7135 is quite readable and bright (even outdoors). Also, because the number of pixels on the screen is the same as a regular Palm device, the pixel density is higher which makes the image sharper (more pixels/inch).

      PDAs should have long battery life. But they don't whe

    • 1) All combo pda/phones should use an earpiece rather than holding the thing to your ear. It only makes sense.

      2) Well if you're used to charging your cellphone every couple of days, then why can't you just charge your cell/pda every couple of days?

      3) The earpiece should be a lot smaller than a cell phone or pda, so the only real weight/size is with the pda. If you can't carry around a little earpiece then where do you plan on carrying your pda?

      4) This is something the providers have to workout. But it's
  • Let's not mistake the decision of the upper management of some large corporation for a good decision, or one with outstanding technical merit. GM does swing a lot of weight and could influence the availability of apps or even the choices of other enterprise customers, but that doesn't mean they've actually made a more informed choice than anyone here --- in fact, I think it's unlikely.
    • As a fleet management device, GM has made the right choice here. The Motorola telephones are great little toys and the nextel billing is very flexible. Currently we use the Motorola i30's in a 200+truck operation. The phone can be programmed with all the numbers they need to have, and locked out from dialing other numbers. The direct-connect function makes it very easy to get a hold of a driver, and does not fall under any of North America's hands-free laws, as it is treated as a CB radio. The phones al
  • I am using an Orange SPV at the moment and I simply cannot invisage buying a PDA with it around. My only small concern is that it lags a little and that the text input is still num pad. But hey thats life , i just dont have the cash for a P800
  • In real life, it's not the technology that's being used that dictates success or failure. Adding layers upon layers of technology doesn't improve anything, unless that tech is used to give the result an edge it otherwise could not have.

    In this case, Java/WebSphere has been available for PDA's for a long time, but isn't being used, because it doesn't add anything useful. Other technologies are being used just as much on PDAs as on cell phones, when actually useful.

    Yes, phones may win, but Occam's razor t

  • PDA's stink anyway (Score:3, Insightful)

    by g0hare ( 565322 ) on Sunday May 25, 2003 @10:18AM (#6034763)
    I can get all the functionality of a PDA from a piece of paper. The only reaon I keep the Toshiba e330 I won is that it IS a fairly decent MP3 player. OTherwise it would have been on Ebay. The last thing I want anyway is to be constantly wired up so that idiots can call me and instant message me about problems they could solve themselves if they used their brains instead of their phones. Now go outside and play.
    • The last thing I want anyway is to be constantly wired up so that idiots can call me and instant message
      The simple (and I would have thought obvious) solution to that is: don't give said idiots your mobile number. I have a mobile phone for my convenience, not other people's.

    • Re:PDA's stink anyway (Score:3, Interesting)

      by Aceticon ( 140883 )
      Off-topic but here it goes:

      The last thing I want anyway is to be constantly wired up so that idiots can call me and instant message me about problems they could solve themselves if they used their brains instead of their phones.

      Try the following:

      1. The first couple of times that an "idiot" comes to you with a simple problem, teach said idiot how to solve it (usually teaching them more than the step-by-step solution for that specific problem is more efficient in the long run)
      2. If the same idiot comes back
  • Who wants to talk nowadays when you can just e-mail or im? duh...

    • Who wants to talk nowadays when you can just e-mail or im? duh...

      That requires a keyboard to carry out with anything resembling efficiency, which I don't think anybody would want to do. Even the fold-up keyboards for Palms and such are a bit much to carry around. As for entering email in your phone, it's way too cumbersome when you have only 12 keys through which you enter 96 possible (ASCII) characters. Sending email through a phone is little more than a gimmick, and it will remain a gimmick until s

  • I got a Smartphone last week (seems to be based on a scaled down version of Windows CE).

    For several years I've used different Palm PDA's with Nokia cell phones. But the Smartphone actually does both things well enough (i.e. being a PDA and being a phone), and it is small and stylish enough not to be a nuisance.

    I know, I know, a lot of you will rush in to tell me how Microsoft Smartphones suck and so on, but I think that the UI of the Smartphone is really good and in some ways innovative and simplified wh
  • Ephraim takes GM's decision to use smart phones over PDAs because they're "not threatening", that will be part of a "field-force management application" for their "noncomputer-savvy workforce", and extends that to "farewell to handhelds"? First, the largest screen Nextel's smart phones have is 1.9 inches, and that's on the $399 model [amazon.com]. I imagine their application simply displays data, since it "responds to a few presses of the keypad". If data display and a few bits of data in response is all you're doin

  • PDAs, maybe - pocket computers, no (Score:3, Insightful)

    by gidds ( 56397 ) <slashdot.gidds@me@uk> on Sunday May 25, 2003 @10:34AM (#6034811) Homepage
    As a long-time user of various Psions (currently a Series 5mx [series5mx.com]), I view the popularity of Palm-style machines as a very mixed blessing. They've brought computer power to people and situations for which it wouldn't otherwise have been suitable, and many folk find them very useful. But they carry subliminal messages: Mobile computers are for data retrieval, not really data entry. They have little memory or computing power. The available applications are small, limited, and proprietary. They're only really suitable as an adjunct to a desktop computer, not a machine in their own right. Etc. etc.

    These limitations (and I know that not all Palm-style machines have them all, but it's a common impression) don't apply to all palmtops. Mine has a keyboard you can touch-type on; I've used it to write articles for publication, large applications, etc. It has a 640x240 screen that's plenty wide enough to read books, web pages, spreadsheets, etc. Its OS (EPOC, the forerunner of Symbian OS currently powering many mobile phones [symbian.com]) is exceptionally stable -- apart from hardware failure, I don't think it's crashed once. Although I have a powerful desktop machine, I only connect to it for backups; everything I use my Psion for stays there, and I've never felt the need to sync with anything else. I have lots of powerful applications at my fingertips: office apps that can exchange files with Word and Excel, route planning/GPS, capable web browsers, a Doom engine and many other games, you name it.

    People are often amazed by the things I've got to hand: the Concise Oxford Dictionary, Brewer's, Webster's, the Jargon File, and loads of similar reference works; three different Bible translations; MBs of fiction and other books; the core data from the IMDB, etc. Most of the time it's my only email client, and also my only Off-Line Reader for the CIX [cix.co.uk] BBS, holding well over 100,000 messages -- both connecting via my mobile phone as well as land lines. It has Java, Perl, Python, and also a powerful built-in language called OPL (recently open-sourced [symbian.com]); and it's possible to do full-scale development on it (I know coz I'm co-author of the OLR [itl.net] mentioned before). It uses standard TrueType &c fonts, displays PDFs, connects with FTP and telnet, plays back MP3s, and loads more. In short, it's a fully-fledged, powerful computer in its own right.

    I mention all this not to show off (well, maybe just a bit :) but to show that there's much more to pocket computers than most people think. (Lots of folks, especially in the USA, have never heard of Psions, which is a shame. Although they're no longer made, second-hand ones are highly sought-after.) And yet most people still think of a palmtop as something just for looking at a few agenda entries, checking a few addresses, and playing a few games.

    If that's all you think a PDA is good for, then no wonder people think you can squeeze it all onto a phone! But for those of us who really use our palmtops, this seems a waste, a travesty of what mobile computing could be.

    OTOH, maybe things aren't so depressing. It's possible that once all those simple PDA functions have been transferred to phones, that there will be room for some market differentiation, and that more powerful palmtops might become more popular. When Psion pulled out of the consumer market, their message was effectively "everyone wants Palms; too few people want something more powerful". Maybe if all of those light users move onto something even smaller (in every respect), there will be enough of us left for it to be worth making powerful pocket computers again.

    Well, I can hope...

  • And of course, because they are cheaper than handhelds, both to purchase and to maintain

    I wonder if this is because the smart phones are subsidised by the phone networks, who make additional income from a contract and services (voice, SMS, MMS, GPRS, downloading games/ringtones etc.. and any other features that can be used from the smartphone).

    I'd doubt that the Bill Of Materials is much different for both device...

  • I don't like PDAs: the size is too small to host good application and still too big for wearing around. And I dislike when PIM functions make the cell unwearable big. If I need to manage my personal information and to run any "field force management application" then I prefer a laptop or perhaps a tablet PC.

    I wonder when the cell phones will get embedded printers, scanners and DVD-burners (keeping already embedded PDAs, camera and MP3 players)? That's the direction they push the cell phone market, isn't i

  • I'd like some sort of modular notebook/small laptop where the phone slid into it. The deal with these different devices is you need the different devices, or all of them, laptop, pda, phone. Now if they integrated with each other in one case, hot swappable somehow. Need a full laptop with a real keyboard? Swell, it's there. Just want the phone part, it's there, either leave it plugged into the laptop where it's your wireless modem and/or phone, or slide it out, carry it with you. The pda part of the combo c

  • I dissagree (Score:4, Interesting)

    by angel'o'sphere ( 80593 ) <{ed.rotnemoo} {ta} {redienhcs.olegna}> on Sunday May 25, 2003 @10:51AM (#6034872) Journal
    I like seperated devices which act as one together.

    Just like a PC + mouse + display are 3 devices but get really usefull as combined: computer.

    I expect my phone to be very smal, enough power to phone for 4 to 6 hours and standby time for 3 days or more. It should be easy wearable at my belt or in my trousers pocket. Just liek the Motorola Star TAC or ist similar looking successors.

    My PDA should be bigger, I dont want such a smal display like UTMS phones have on my PDA, neither I want a bigger phone to have a bigger display.

    My PDA shold be a extension to my personal computer, having snapshots of my important data on it.

    I expect PDA and Phone to interact seemlessly via bluethoos, where the phone recognices the adressbook on the PDA as extension ... and the java programs on the PDA as external stored programs, accessible on the phone if fitting, ignored otherwise.

    My PDA however should not need to get configured to be internet or local network aware. It should just recognize my phone as network adapter. Also via Bluetooth.

    I like to work with that part of the combo I find more appropriated at the certain moment in time.

    I dont want a mixed beast where several teams of hardware and software developers work hard to put the combined dissadvantages of both kinds of devices into one device.

    Regards,
    angel'o'sphere
  • You're going to end up with reduced quality of both components. You'll have a substandard PDA that eats your cellphone battery. If you throw in a digital camera as well, it'll probably be 640x480 at best, eat your battery, and...y'know, decent lenses and flashmemory have mass and volume. Me, I'd rather have a light, easily-accessible cellphone that I actually will bother to carry on walks and stuff. And if it's stolen, I haven't lost my organizer too. If I ever have the inclination, the need, and the m

  • Farewell to Schwartz (Score:3, Interesting)

    by fm6 ( 162816 ) on Sunday May 25, 2003 @11:02AM (#6034914) Homepage Journal
    Once again, we have a columnist with the most superficial understanding of a technology and a marketplace trying to spin the deepest implications. Won't work. We talking a specialized device here: a "field-force management" app for truck drivers!

    I guess a big part of this is GM/Nextel spin. The device has a lot of PDA functionality. But a smart phone is "less threatening", so they call it that even if drivers mostly use it to access the network and run Java apps. Though I seem to recall that Nextel's network is CDMA, and my experiences with data over that kind of network is not positive.

    Contrast this with UPS's deployment of a super-connectable PDA [slashdot.org]. Not to mention the recent release [slashdot.org] of bunch of new PalmOS devices. Some of which, yes, are smart phones. But when you base a smart phone on PalmOS or Symbian, do you have a phone with PDA functions or a PDA that makes phone calls? Not that I like either -- I want two separate devices, connected by Bluetooth.

  • This is so ridiculous. Java is the phone's killer app? I have a visorphone, and it has a stable of useful, freely available apps that run sans java. Telnet, a browser, and about a zillion other kinds of *ware that I can try out, without buying it from a freakin' phone company.

    Granted, it's great to have a stable, widely-developed platform built-in, but it remains to be seen what it will be used for. Geotargeted coupons? Kill me now. "Excuse me, my wife's in labor, I have to take this call...$5 OFF THE STAR
  • is this [therasense.com].

    It's one less thing I have to lug around with me. I doubt smart phones will be able to do anything like this anytime soon.

    I just wish my Handspring would act as a phone, play MP3s and connect to the 2-meter ham repeaters around town. That'd be three fewer pieces of junk I'd have to lug around with me. But, I'd probably have to recharge its battery every 20 minutes or so.
  • The concept of the personal area network, connected by bluetooth, is finally implemented. Samsung will be releasing the first such device suite later this year, at which point things will probably start to come to fruition.

    The problem is this: turning a PDA into a phone keeps it as a decent PDA, usually, but makes a terrible phone from a user interface standpoint...touchscreen buttons are a pain in the ass, and nobody wants fingerprints all over their PDA screen. And it's a pain to hold the entire damned
  • I won a Viewsonic PocketPC and gave it away. I don't want to carry two devices, even if the PDA portion is better than my Treo. Since shifting to Treo my pockets are way lighter. It works just fine as a phone and the keyboard is quite suitable for text entry once you learn to trust your thumbs.

    Case in point: I am using my treo now to enter this message and browse slashdot while waiting for my oil change to be completed.

  • Comment removed based on user account deletion
  • Like many on this forum I've often pondered the ideal marriage between PDA and mobile phone; everyone seems to agree that they would make a great combination, if only we could somehow find that balance between PDA and phone functionality.

    The salient points are these:

    - Phones are more important to more people than organizers. That's the one overriding rule. Organizers are very handy, and even indispensable for a very small percentage of people.. but everyone needs a phone. Everyone. Soon 'mobile phone' w

  • All we really need..... (Score:3, Informative)

    by Viceice ( 462967 ) on Sunday May 25, 2003 @12:44PM (#6035391)
    Are a bluetooth enabled PDA, Phone and a real comfy headphone.

    Make the phone as small as you can, with no buttons (save for Power and BT interface), speakers, screen or mike, with as much battery as you can.

    Then supply a phone interface app for PalmOS/PocketPC/Linux PDA's and you're set to go.

    You can hide your phone anywhere on your person as you'll never have to reach for it, you can do every wireless data thing on your PDA and take teh calls on your headset and use it for mp3 playback as well.

    Taht way, everything is at it's optimal size, and they all don't drain 1 battery. If the phone dies you still have your PDA and vice versa.

  • The only thing I ever wanted was a GSM integrated with my IIIc. That's it.

    Sure, now I want high rez (480-320), dedicated mp3 support, removable storage and graffitti area, but just a IIIc with an internal GSM would have done it for me too.

    And I've been saying that since I got my palmpilot...which is in the first month the IIIc was available. Palm/3com/whoever is just plain fucking dumb not to have done it since then (and no, Tungsten C is shit...I do not want a phone/pda without graffitti or which only wo
  • I haven't owned one, don't own one, and don't plan to own one. I like not being accessible 24/7. I'll stick with my WiFi-connected Sony Clie NX70V, thank you very much.

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